Seems that some of you have already received your viewers and I am getting
some interesting negative feedback.

Feedback #1:

> 1) focus knob does not work, lenses free floatin in and out, no way to
> control them.
> 2) Its impossible to insert a view, as their is a buckle of the rear
> mask. It bows from the center (attached to rear) to the sides, which
> are touching the front.

Feedback #2:

> Right lens is "In" 3mm relative to the left. Focus is very rough, it
> skips. IPD rough adjust also. Batteries go in which way? Finally got
> them in right and I need to slip in a screwdriver blade at the end to
> complete the circuit, otherwise no light. Looking at a view, I cannot
> see top corners. Cuts in about 10mm on right, about 3mm on the left.

Can you please check your viewers to make sure they are working OK? I am a
bit concerned about the alignment of the focus. I did not see this in the
few viewers I check and I did not check any viewers before shipping them
out.

The focus and interocular methods are not robust, that's for sure. Which
way the batteries go, I hope you'll figure it out (Positive - part
sticking out - is facing out of the viewer). This "cannot see the top
corners and cuts 10mm to the right and 3mm to the left" must be related to
the type of mounts used because I can see the entire image area.

George Themelis

I just got my viewers today and will respond later. The lens holders
are one piece now, at least one piece on the exterior of the viewer,
unlike other pictures I saw of the first batch. With those you could
unscrew the lens barrel to easily get to the retaining ring. Can't do
that on mine and wouldn't need to except that I purchased the 66mm
lenses from Edmunds to pop in. Taking the viewer apart, it still
appears that the lens barrel is one piece. There is still a retaining
ring, although I could not get mine to budge. The lens barrel appears
to be aluminum and coated, also on the inside and on the threads just
past the retaining ring. So it doesn't appear that you could unscrew
the retaining ring even if I wanted to. Crap, I wanted to put these
lenses in a viewer.

Dale Yingst

I received my viewer from the first batch.Although it needs tweaking,
I feel it is a great value, and the lenses are very sharp.

BUT... The slot is to rough and too narrow. It scratches the
protective sleeves. If any folio members decide to use this viewer,
please make sure you smooth down the edges of the slot.

I will be sending this as a message to all my folios, as I do not want
anyone's images damaged.

Sam

I got mine today.

No markings as to how the batteries go in but I got it right
the second try. (Positive to the right) The batteries
stick a little so I had to tap the viewer side a few times
to get the batteries to all touch each other.

I found no malfunctions with mine (other than the sticking
batteries). Interocular moves freely and smooth (maybe too
freely).

Focus range is smooth. I need to focus all the way out for
my eyes and I am using 80X132 mounts which I can push to the
back of the slot for best focus. I don't have a 80X140
mounted slide to test but I am concerned that it may not
focus for me using them.

The back light should have been made taller (but there isn't
any room for a taller back light) as what can be seen in the
viewer is dark spots where the LEDs are and then it is
brighter just above that. I do have one empty 80X140 mount
that I put in and it covers the black spots but the light is
brighter at the bottom edge than over the rest of the view
area. May not be too noticeable with a view in it.

If you lift a plastic mount just a couple of mm the upper
inside corners have no light panel because of the notch to
grip the mount for removal is there. If you don't get the
mount all the way in you will see them.

The mounts go all the way inside the viewer except at that
notch so making an adaptor from a plastic mount for 80X132
mounts will be tricky if you want to just pull it out to
view a plastic mounted slide.

I think I got one of the better ones.

Chuck Holzner

Hi,

    Mine arrived today as well.  First things first -- it does seem to
be focused using my bare eyes with the lenses all the way in as
far as it goes.  Can't focus it either side to see if it's optimal, it
seems to "just" get into focus as it hits as far back as it goes. Both
sides seem to be equally focused.  Wish it were symmetric with a power
on/off switch on the left side as well as the current right side.
Seems to work well wearing glasses (or presumably my contacts although
I haven't tried it with them as of yet).
    I had no trouble with the batteries other than getting the battery
cover back on with the batteries installed (Costco Kirkland branded
batteries).  Felt I had to push a bit hard to get it to go in, there
didn't seem to be quite enough room with batteries installed.  As to
the polarity, I guessed right the first time.  Usually there is a spring
on the negative end, and the visible end didn't have any -- so
it appeared the visible end was the positive.  Worked.  Mine also loaded
in tightly, so presumably the spring on the negative end was properly
extended while the one reported in "feedback #2" must have been excessively
compressed or missing.
    Focus knobs works but toward the end I use it just "jumps" to the
end, doesn't have good control near that end -- but as it happens I
need it right at the end (when bare eyed) so it wasn't a problem.
    As to the reported bow in the mask, mine had none (looking down
into the slot).  Looking into the just out of the box viewer with
batteries just installed shows a lot of specks/spots, not sure where
those are from just now.  Not evident with my one dark test slide.
    I spotted the light/darkness near the bottom that someone has mentioned
but the one slide I just tried it with is a night shot and that area is
dark so it doesn't show.  The slide also is used in my Saturn viewer and
is of "that" mount, so it has wiggle-room inserted.  But that didn't
seem to be a problem, at least with this particular slide (long night
street shot in Vegas of the Bellagio where the heavy traffic disappears
into light streaks due to the long exposure).
    There's a lot more testing needed with more slides and such (and for
the acid test of seeing whether my wife can use it, particularly with
her wider than average eye spacing). But on first impression I'm
happy -- certainly a lot less assembly and polyurethane than
my Saturn viewer. But the Saturn viewer is prettier.  :-)

Mike K.




DrT (George Themelis) wrote:

Seems that some of you have already received your viewers and I am getting  some interesting negative feedback.  Feedback #1:    

1)  focus knob does not work, lenses free floatin in and out, no way to  control them. 2)  Its impossible to insert a view, as their is a buckle of the rear  mask.  It bows from the center (attached to rear) to the sides, which  are touching the front.     

 Feedback #2:    

Right lens is "In" 3mm relative to the left. Focus is very rough, it  skips. IPD rough adjust also. Batteries go in which way?  Finally got  them in right and I need to slip in a screwdriver blade at the end to  complete the circuit, otherwise no light.   Looking at a view, I cannot  see top corners. Cuts in about 10mm on right, about 3mm on the left.     

 Can you please check your viewers to make sure they are working OK? I am a  bit concerned about the alignment of the focus. I did not see this in the  few viewers I check and I did not check any viewers before shipping them  out.  The focus and interocular methods are not robust, that's for sure.  Which  way the batteries go, I hope you'll figure it out (Positive - part  sticking out - is facing out of the viewer).  This "cannot see the top  corners and cuts 10mm to the right and 3mm to the left" must be related to  the type of mounts used because I can see the entire image area.  George Themelis    ------------------------------------  Yahoo! Groups Links  <*> To visit your group on the web, go to:     http://groups.yahoo.com/group/MF3D-group/  <*> Your email settings:     Individual Email | Traditional  <*> To change settings online go to:     http://groups.yahoo.com/group/MF3D-group/join     (Yahoo! ID required)  <*> To change settings via email:     mailto:MF3D-group-digest@yahoogroups.com      mailto:MF3D-group-fullfeatured@yahoogroups.com  <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:     MF3D-group-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com  <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:     http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/      

There was previous mention of internal reflections in the first viewer
batch. With these new viewers, the internal area seems to be well
baffled and covered in a flat black coating.

I think they did a pretty good job with the lighting. The lighting
appears natural, not warm. Since I had mine apart, I am going to
paint the back of the light panel white and also the front along the
bottom. You can't see that area with a slide inserted. This will
probably increase the lighting in a very small way. The panel is
already pretty well light reflecting on the back.

If I can't figure out a way to put in the Edmunds 66mm lenses in these
new viewers, I'll have to find a vendor with some first batch models
or swap someone for my second unopened new batch viewer.

With contacts in, I have to focus the viewer at just a tiny smidge
before full extension. With contacts out, I cannot get it to focus
even when lenses are fully retracted. I didn't expect the viewer to
be designed for uncorrected vision.

I do have a question regarding setting the interocular. If I set
the lenses to the narrowest spacing, I see the views with just the
tiniest bit of corner clipping all around, but it is equal clipping in
all corners. If I move them further apart, the depth effect effect
seems a little better, but the inside corners of the images are more
clipped. So where should I set them?

I like the rack focus, although the focusing is a little
stiff(fortunately). You should use both focusing levers, but doing
that and pressing the switch at the same time is awkward. I can get
used to it but what about the person you pass the viewer to. For less
than twice the price of the STL model and with these features, this
viewer is a great buy.

Dale Yingst

Hi Dale,

I'm sorry to hear that the focus range still doesn't suit your eyes
and that there's no way to swap out the 75mm lenses for the 66mm
lenses. As you've already considered (trying another vendor), you
might want to give www.3DStereo.com a call and find out if they have
any of the original versions, with the threaded lens retainer
rings. http://www.3dstereo.com/viewmaster/mts-2ql.html

Regarding the interocular spacing, everyone should start with the
lenses set to a separation of 65mm. This is the ideal spacing for a
viewer equipped with 75mm lenses and mounts that have a 62mm window separation.

Ideal Lens Separation = Window Separation + (Viewer FL / 30) + 0.5mm
= 62.0 + (75.0/30) + 0.5 = 65.0mm

The maximum lens separation for the 3DWorld viewer is 66.0mm, so I'm
recommending that you spread the lenses as far apart as they'll go,
then bring them back in about half a millimeter each. (You can leave
them at 66mm if you want - that just means you'll have to converge
your eyes a little bit more when fusing Near homologs. But, to avoid
divergence when fusing views with OFDs that are as great as MAOFD
(Viewer FL / 30), you should really try to avoid pushing the lenses
closer together than 65mm.

If your eyes are just too close together to see well through the
clear apertures when the lenses are at 65mm, then you'll have no
choice but to take the risk of suffering divergence when fusing Far
homologs in stereo views where the Far homologs are farther apart
than the lens separation. Go ahead and push the lenses just close
enough together to permit use of the clear apertures. Suffering a
little divergence is better than not using the viewer at all, I suppose.

If your eyes have an IPD that's down near the interocular adjustment
minimum of 61mm or even less, you should really resist the temptation
to center the lenses over your eyes. Doing so will reduce the
distortion experienced when our eyes are not on-axis with the lenses,
but you'll only be guaranteeing that you have to diverge your eyes to
fuse literally every part of every stereo view that has Nears mounted
to the window (because the 61mm lens separation will be less than the
62mm mount separation).

The ideal (expensive) viewer design would have chips that move with
the lenses so that we could keep the lenses both centered over our
eyes and centered over the Far homologs. And it takes a very
complicated (very expensive) design to make this happen with chips
that are nearly as wide (or wider) than the average IPD. With any
(affordable) viewer that has a fixed chip separation, there's really
not much to be gained by having adjustable lens separation, except to
service that part of the population that has IPDs exceeding the ideal
lens separation (as defined with the formula above). That's why
George asked 3DWorld to change the interocular adjustment range to
begin at 64mm instead of 61mm, but it sounds as if we're going to
have to wait a while to see that get fixed.

Mike Davis

Greetings,

Thank you all for your feedback.

I am in the process of checking every viewer now before shipping, to make
sure everything is working OK. I will report my results/conclusions when
I am done. If you already received a viewer with problems, let me know
and I will replace it.

It is a good idea to change the focus using both hands and levers (I can
do that and still press the light :)). Once the focus is set, you don't
really need to change it from slide to slide (if you are the only one
using the viewer). About the interocular, as Mike said, I would keep mine
at the widest setting all the time.

Regarding Dale's request for the first batch viewers, I will ask 3d World,
1) if there is an easy way (which is not obvious) to remove the lenses in
the new batch, 2) if they have any parts from the first batch to sell (or
maybe give me for free). I have a feeling that there are remaining parts
from the 1st batch, so I suggest that you wait for a while. I got a pair
of the shorter FL lenses myself but don't have any 1st batch viewers, so I
am personally interested in this.

George Themelis

DrT (George Themelis) wrote:

>
>
> Regarding Dale's request for the first batch viewers, I will ask 3d
> World,
> 1) if there is an easy way (which is not obvious) to remove the lenses in
> the new batch, 2) if they have any parts from the first batch to sell (or
> maybe give me for free). I have a feeling that there are remaining parts
> from the 1st batch, so I suggest that you wait for a while. I got a pair
> of the shorter FL lenses myself but don't have any 1st batch viewers,
> so I
> am personally interested in this.
>

That would be great George. To my eyes the barrels containing the
lenses as well as the connecting and moving piece them is all one
item. Although that seems like a difficult piece to manufacture that
way and I hope I'm wrong.

Dale Yingst

>
>