Header banner

MF3D-group Conversations Photos Files All groups About
<< Previous Thread Running out of stock, 3DWorld viewers - black color Next Thread >>

Subject: Running out of stock, 3DWorld viewers - black color
Date: 2012-10-16 07:29:29
From: George Themelis
Hi Guys,

Just a warning, I am running out of stock in the black available-light
Medium Format viewers:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=221090671500

I ordered 300 of these viewers a couple of years ago. They made them back
at that point. Since then, they have switched to silver color. So, I have
the only stock of black viewers. I recently got an order for 30 and just
now another order for 15. I only have 10 left in stock. Once these are
sold, there will be no more black viewers.

These viewers have great achromatic lenses and honestly for the price of
these lenses you are getting a free viewer :)

Thanks,

George
Subject: Re: Running out of stock, 3DWorld viewers - black color
Date: 2012-10-17 05:10:05
From: bob_karambelas
I'm sitting here wondering which will give out first:

a: my discontinued MF camera
b: my discontinued MF viewers
c: my supply of MF mounts
d: slide film manufacture
e: slide film processing

so far, so good.

--- In MF3D-group@yahoogroups.com, "George Themelis" wrote:
Subject: Re: Running out of stock, 3DWorld viewers - black color
Date: 2012-10-18 04:57:12
From: coronet3d
--- In MF3D-group@yahoogroups.com, "bob_karambelas" wrote:
>
> I'm sitting here wondering which will give out first:
>
> a: my discontinued MF camera
> b: my discontinued MF viewers
> c: my supply of MF mounts
> d: slide film manufacture
> e: slide film processing
>
> so far, so good.
>
You could use your MF SLR to expose print film to make stereocards. Slides aren't the only option. Plus, there are B&W slides. B&W film seems more resistant to discontinuation.
Steve
Subject: Re: Running out of stock, 3DWorld viewers - black color
Date: 2012-10-18 10:37:14
From: John Thurston
On 10/18/2012 2:57 AM, coronet3d wrote:
> --- In MF3D-group@yahoogroups.com, "bob_karambelas" wrote:
>>
>> I'm sitting here wondering which will give out first:
>>
>> a: my discontinued MF camera
>> b: my discontinued MF viewers
>> c: my supply of MF mounts
>> d: slide film manufacture
>> e: slide film processing
>>
>> so far, so good.
>>
> You could use your MF SLR to expose print film to make stereocards. Slides aren't the only option. Plus, there are B&W slides. B&W film seems more resistant to discontinuation.

Steve, if I'm going to make stereo cards, I certainly am not going to
grab my Tl120 (or even a single MF camera) as the first choice of
equipment. A modern digital camera captures more than enough information
to generate cards. There is no need for me to suffer the expense of 120
film and processing for this purpose.

I agree, though, with your assessment of B/W film. I think it will
persist longer than E6 and I love the images I get on my DR5-processed
HP5. Unfortunately, it is the most expensive of all of my image-making
options. I've done two rolls of it each of the last two years and that
is about as far as my pocketbook will stretch.

John Thurston
Juneau, Alaska
Subject: Re: Running out of stock, 3DWorld viewers - black color
Date: 2012-10-18 12:41:25
From: coronet3d
--- In MF3D-group@yahoogroups.com, John Thurston wrote:
> > You could use your MF SLR to expose print film to make stereocards. Slides aren't the only option. Plus, there are B&W slides. B&W film seems more resistant to discontinuation.
>
> Steve, if I'm going to make stereo cards, I certainly am not going to
> grab my Tl120 (or even a single MF camera) as the first choice of
> equipment. A modern digital camera captures more than enough information
> to generate cards. There is no need for me to suffer the expense of 120
> film and processing for this purpose.
>
There's a stereo digital camera out there that can outresolve contact prints made with Ektar 100?
Steve
Subject: Re: Running out of stock, 3DWorld viewers - black color
Date: 2012-10-18 13:21:30
From: John Thurston
On 10/18/2012 10:41 AM, coronet3d wrote:
> --- In MF3D-group@yahoogroups.com, John Thurston wrote:
>>> You could use your MF SLR to expose print film to make stereocards. Slides aren't the only option. Plus, there are B&W slides. B&W film seems more resistant to discontinuation.
>>
>> Steve, if I'm going to make stereo cards, I certainly am not going to
>> grab my Tl120 (or even a single MF camera) as the first choice of
>> equipment. A modern digital camera captures more than enough information
>> to generate cards. There is no need for me to suffer the expense of 120
>> film and processing for this purpose.
>>
> There's a stereo digital camera out there that can outresolve contact prints made with Ektar 100?

Nope. Didn't know you were gonna go wet-print your cards. You
get all the pain and suffering of MF3D without the
slide-viewing pleasure. It feels a bit to me like swimming
upstream towing your canoe. Sure, you can do it, but why not
get in, paddle the canoe, and enjoy the trip?

IMHO, if you're gonna do wet prints, make 'em 8x10 or 9x12
and use a Mirscope. But that is just *my* opinion.
________________________________________
John Thurston
Juneau, Alaska
http://stereo.thurstons.us
Subject: Re: Running out of stock, 3DWorld viewers - black color
Date: 2012-10-18 13:37:27
From: coronet3d
--- In MF3D-group@yahoogroups.com, John Thurston wrote:
> Nope. Didn't know you were gonna go wet-print your cards. You
> get all the pain and suffering of MF3D without the
> slide-viewing pleasure. It feels a bit to me like swimming
> upstream towing your canoe. Sure, you can do it, but why not
> get in, paddle the canoe, and enjoy the trip?
>
When I first started out with my Sputnik, I would make stereo cards from time to time. I had thought there were still Holmes card enthusiasts out there. My point was that the gear can still be used. Modern contact printed images rival slides IMO but I like the immersion you get with a slide viewer. I've seen some high-end internally lit Holmes card viewers on the internet, but don't have any idea how they would stack up to a slide viewer.
Steve
Subject: Re: Running out of stock, 3DWorld viewers - black color
Date: 2012-10-18 14:41:46
From: Geoffrey S. Waldo
Hi
I agree with John, and love the imagery of the canoe scene...!
Geoff


Geoffrey S. Waldo, PhD
Mail Stop M888
Los Alamos National Laboratory
Los Alamos, NM 87545

Tel:  505-667-8161                 email: waldo@LANL.gov
Fax: 505-665-3024
Cell: 505-204-6979


Los Alamos Fluorescent Proteins Website: http://www.lanl.gov/projects/gfp/
•Superfolder, Folding Reporter, Split Proteins
•Tools for engineering protein folding, stability, and solubility
•Protein interactions, tagging, and detection

ISFI Integrated Center for Structure and Function Innovation web site: http://techcenter.mbi.ucla.edu

__________________________________________
Consulting 
Cell: 505-204-6979

On Oct 18, 2012, at 1:21 PM, John Thurston <juneau3d@thurstons.us> wrote:

 

On 10/18/2012 10:41 AM, coronet3d wrote:
> --- In MF3D-group@yahoogroups.com, John Thurston wrote:
>>> You could use your MF SLR to expose print film to make stereocards. Slides aren't the only option. Plus, there are B&W slides. B&W film seems more resistant to discontinuation.
>>
>> Steve, if I'm going to make stereo cards, I certainly am not going to
>> grab my Tl120 (or even a single MF camera) as the first choice of
>> equipment. A modern digital camera captures more than enough information
>> to generate cards. There is no need for me to suffer the expense of 120
>> film and processing for this purpose.
>>
> There's a stereo digital camera out there that can outresolve contact prints made with Ektar 100?

Nope. Didn't know you were gonna go wet-print your cards. You
get all the pain and suffering of MF3D without the
slide-viewing pleasure. It feels a bit to me like swimming
upstream towing your canoe. Sure, you can do it, but why not
get in, paddle the canoe, and enjoy the trip?

IMHO, if you're gonna do wet prints, make 'em 8x10 or 9x12
and use a Mirscope. But that is just *my* opinion.
________________________________________
John Thurston
Juneau, Alaska
http://stereo.thurstons.us

Subject: Re: Running out of stock, 3DWorld viewers - black color
Date: 2012-10-19 06:50:45
From: bob_karambelas
When they stop making slide film, I'll stop shooting 3D.

--- In MF3D-group@yahoogroups.com, "coronet3d" wrote:

> You could use your MF SLR to expose print film to make stereocards. Slides aren't the only option. Plus, there are B&W slides. B&W film seems more resistant to discontinuation.
> Steve
>
Subject: Re: Running out of stock, 3DWorld viewers - black color
Date: 2012-10-19 08:34:56
From: coronet3d
--- In MF3D-group@yahoogroups.com, "bob_karambelas" wrote:
>
> When they stop making slide film, I'll stop shooting 3D.
>
I don't know much about the TL-120, but would it be possible to hang a pair of MF digital backs on it? When you say slide film, do you mean color only or color and B&W?
Steve
Subject: Re: Running out of stock, 3DWorld viewers - black color
Date: 2012-10-19 10:12:06
From: Boris Starosta

Posted by:

"coronet3d" coronet3d

  I've seen some high-end internally lit Holmes card viewers on the internet, but don't have any idea how they would stack up to a slide viewer.
Steve


Have you seen this one?
http://www.seriousviewers.com/products/products1.htm

There was another ultimate Holmes format card viewer on the market briefly ten(?) years ago, lighted with very short FL achromats.  Anyone remember the name of that (unsuccessful at googling for it using the more general terms "stereoscope modern new ultimate etc.").


Like with everything else that is "ultimate" in 3d, it is either very expensive and/or not being made anymore and very hard to find for sale.

I agree with John, though, a MirScope or aerial photogrammetry (?) stereoscope would be ideal with large wet process prints, if your aim is to reproduce MF quality imagery.


––––

Architecture begins where engineering ends.
Walter Gropius


Subject: Re: Running out of stock, 3DWorld viewers - black color
Date: 2012-10-19 11:38:41
From: John Thurston
On 10/19/2012 6:34 AM, coronet3d wrote:
> --- In MF3D-group@yahoogroups.com, "bob_karambelas" wrote:
>>
>> When they stop making slide film, I'll stop shooting 3D.
>>
> I don't know much about the TL-120, but would it be possible to hang a pair of MF digital backs on it?

With enough money, everything is possible. But why would you
want to?

You get the:
expense of two digital backs
bulk of carting around three f/2.8 lenses
inflexibility of fixed lenses
inflexibility of fixed lens spacing
joy of syncing the backs to the mechanical shutters
joy of syncing the backs to each other

This is bolting two Mercury outboards to your canoe and
_then_ towing the whole thing upstream. Once you get it
up-river, it will go like a bat out of hell...for about 25
yards before swamping.
The experience would make an interesting 3-minute filler for
the 6-O'clock news, but I can't see it as a usable device.

John Thurston
Juneau, Alaska
Subject: Re: Running out of stock, 3DWorld viewers - black color
Date: 2012-10-19 12:03:35
From: Geoffrey S. Waldo
I love the hyperbole! John, are you a kayak or canoe enthusiast by any chance?


Geoffrey S. Waldo, PhD
Mail Stop M888
Los Alamos National Laboratory
Los Alamos, NM 87545

Tel:  505-667-8161                 email: waldo@LANL.gov
Fax: 505-665-3024
Cell: 505-204-6979


Los Alamos Fluorescent Proteins Website: http://www.lanl.gov/projects/gfp/
•Superfolder, Folding Reporter, Split Proteins
•Tools for engineering protein folding, stability, and solubility
•Protein interactions, tagging, and detection

ISFI Integrated Center for Structure and Function Innovation web site: http://techcenter.mbi.ucla.edu

__________________________________________
Consulting 
Cell: 505-204-6979

On Oct 19, 2012, at 11:38 AM, John Thurston <juneau3d@thurstons.us> wrote:

 

On 10/19/2012 6:34 AM, coronet3d wrote:
> --- In MF3D-group@yahoogroups.com, "bob_karambelas" wrote:
>>
>> When they stop making slide film, I'll stop shooting 3D.
>>
> I don't know much about the TL-120, but would it be possible to hang a pair of MF digital backs on it?

With enough money, everything is possible. But why would you
want to?

You get the:
expense of two digital backs
bulk of carting around three f/2.8 lenses
inflexibility of fixed lenses
inflexibility of fixed lens spacing
joy of syncing the backs to the mechanical shutters
joy of syncing the backs to each other

This is bolting two Mercury outboards to your canoe and
_then_ towing the whole thing upstream. Once you get it
up-river, it will go like a bat out of hell...for about 25
yards before swamping.
The experience would make an interesting 3-minute filler for
the 6-O'clock news, but I can't see it as a usable device.

John Thurston
Juneau, Alaska

Subject: Re: Running out of stock, 3DWorld viewers - black color
Date: 2012-10-19 14:46:05
From: Brian Reynolds
John Thurston wrote:
> On 10/18/2012 2:57 AM, coronet3d wrote:
> >
> > You could use your MF SLR to expose print film to make
> > stereocards. Slides aren't the only option. Plus, there are B&W
> > slides. B&W film seems more resistant to discontinuation.
>
> Steve, if I'm going to make stereo cards, I certainly am not going
> to grab my Tl120 (or even a single MF camera) as the first choice of
> equipment. A modern digital camera captures more than enough
> information to generate cards. There is no need for me to suffer the
> expense of 120 film and processing for this purpose.

In my experience, even when the output is a consumer level digital
print (e.g., an Apple iPhoto book), starting with a MF film negative
is an improvement over shooting digital directly.

My first successful SoFoBoMo project was shot with a Yashica Mat-124 G
on Kodak T-Max 400 film. A couple of my other books were done with
DSLRs, and one with a Pentax K1000 SE. The book based on MF photos is
visibly higher quality.

> I agree, though, with your assessment of B/W film. I think it will
> persist longer than E6 and I love the images I get on my
> DR5-processed HP5. Unfortunately, it is the most expensive of all of
> my image-making options. I've done two rolls of it each of the last
> two years and that is about as far as my pocketbook will stretch.

You could process B&W reversal yourself, and save money. I've only
done B&W negative myself, but there were formulas, and procedures
posted on this mailing list for B&W reversal. Someone with the old
archives could probably dig out the posts. A google for the usual
suspects (e.g., Sam Smith, Joel Alpers) would probably find some
online information.

You can also get Reversal Developer for T-Max from Photographer's
Forumlary.

--
Brian Reynolds | "It's just like flying a spaceship.
reynolds@panix.com | You push some buttons and see
http://www.panix.com/~reynolds/ | what happens." -- Zapp Brannigan
NAR# 54438 |
Subject: Re: Running out of stock, 3DWorld viewers - black color
Date: 2012-10-19 14:59:10
From: Brian Reynolds
bob_karambelas wrote:
>
> When they stop making slide film, I'll stop shooting 3D.

But they did stop making slide film.

When I run out of my stash of Kodak E100G I'll have to make a choice.
Try B&W slides, switch to Fujifilm, or stop shooting MF3D slides.

Even if I stop shooting MF3D slides I have a big enough backlog of
unmounted slides to keep me busy for a while.

I always thought I'd run out of slide mounts before I'd run out of
film. Now I don't think that's true anymore.

--
Brian Reynolds | "It's just like flying a spaceship.
reynolds@panix.com | You push some buttons and see
http://www.panix.com/~reynolds/ | what happens." -- Zapp Brannigan
NAR# 54438 |