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Subject: Considering MF twin rig
Date: 2013-02-11 20:02:01
From: bob_karambelas
I don't think it's something I'd use very often, so I can't get too fancy, but I've always wanted to shoot some scenic MF hypers. I have a Fuji GW690-II (90mm lens) and a GSW690-II (65mm), really great lenses on both. I wonder if it would be useful to double up one of them, which would cost ~$500. I could just shoot ten rolls and sell it, that's how I'll probably rationalize it. ;)

Obviously some issues, trigger by cable release only, but that should be good enough. But what to do with a 6x9 frame? There's no way to use commercial mounts or viewers, so I guess I'd just have to cut them down.

How badly might the lenses mismatch? If they're not perfect, are they often "good enough"? I've never noticed any problems using random 35mm lenses, but maybe MF is more demanding.
Subject: Re: Considering MF twin rig
Date: 2013-02-12 02:49:19
From: Bob Aldridge
I've used a pair of old Hasselblads in the past (I still have them :) ) but it's a big lump to carry around.

If you're going to shoot landscapes, possibly with larger separations, why not try some sequentials with the cameras that you have?

Your sync won't be perfect with the twin rig, so the sequentials won't be too different - especially if you choose your subjects carefully.

Obviously, you also keep your eyes open for a bargain twin on offer, but this gets you started straight away...

Bob Aldridge

On 12/02/2013 02:02, bob_karambelas wrote:
 

I don't think it's something I'd use very often, so I can't get too fancy, but I've always wanted to shoot some scenic MF hypers. I have a Fuji GW690-II (90mm lens) and a GSW690-II (65mm), really great lenses on both. I wonder if it would be useful to double up one of them, which would cost ~$500. I could just shoot ten rolls and sell it, that's how I'll probably rationalize it. ;)

Obviously some issues, trigger by cable release only, but that should be good enough. But what to do with a 6x9 frame? There's no way to use commercial mounts or viewers, so I guess I'd just have to cut them down.

How badly might the lenses mismatch? If they're not perfect, are they often "good enough"? I've never noticed any problems using random 35mm lenses, but maybe MF is more demanding.


Subject: Re: Considering MF twin rig
Date: 2013-02-12 09:10:01
From: tpuhakka@ymail.com
You could consider a pair of Zeiss Iconta 6X6 folding cameras or there are two Moskova 5 cameras on ebay right now that use a 6X6 mask. They would cost less than $500 for the pair.

Timo

--- In MF3D-group@yahoogroups.com, "bob_karambelas" wrote:
>
> I don't think it's something I'd use very often, so I can't get too fancy, but I've always wanted to shoot some scenic MF hypers. I have a Fuji GW690-II (90mm lens) and a GSW690-II (65mm), really great lenses on both. I wonder if it would be useful to double up one of them, which would cost ~$500. I could just shoot ten rolls and sell it, that's how I'll probably rationalize it. ;)
>
> Obviously some issues, trigger by cable release only, but that should be good enough. But what to do with a 6x9 frame? There's no way to use commercial mounts or viewers, so I guess I'd just have to cut them down.
>
> How badly might the lenses mismatch? If they're not perfect, are they often "good enough"? I've never noticed any problems using random 35mm lenses, but maybe MF is more demanding.
>
Subject: Re: Considering MF twin rig
Date: 2013-02-12 10:48:36
From: fatsostupidlife
>
>You could consider a pair of Zeiss Iconta 6X6 folding cameras or there are two Moskova 5 cameras on ebay right now that use a 6X6 mask. They would cost less than $500 for the pair.
>
>Timo
>

Or a pair of Agfa Isolettes (LOTS on ebay) 50 to 100 each,
try and get the same lens and shutter on them

They are folders, so you get a very compact rig

Best,
John Billingham (2nd cheapest man in NYC)
Subject: Re: Considering MF twin rig
Date: 2013-02-12 10:57:23
From: Don Munsil
I use two Rolleicord TLRs, which I got for around $140 each, plus about $60 (for the pair) to have them cleaned and adjusted. They have excellent lenses and are a pleasure to use, as manual mechanical cameras go. I'm guessing they may be even cheaper now.


On Tue, Feb 12, 2013 at 8:46 AM, <narjan@pipeline.com> wrote:
 


>
>You could consider a pair of Zeiss Iconta 6X6 folding cameras or there are two Moskova 5 cameras on ebay right now that use a 6X6 mask. They would cost less than $500 for the pair.
>
>Timo
>

Or a pair of Agfa Isolettes (LOTS on ebay) 50 to 100 each,
try and get the same lens and shutter on them

They are folders, so you get a very compact rig

Best,
John Billingham (2nd cheapest man in NYC)


Subject: Re: Considering MF twin rig
Date: 2013-02-12 18:13:13
From: bob_karambelas
Don't know whether to thank you or curse you for pointing those out. I've been wanting a folder. ;)

Not sure whether I'll do even do this, but thanks for the input.

> Or a pair of Agfa Isolettes (LOTS on ebay) 50 to 100 each,
> try and get the same lens and shutter on them
>
> They are folders, so you get a very compact rig
>
> Best,
> John Billingham (2nd cheapest man in NYC)
>
Subject: Re: Considering MF twin rig
Date: 2013-02-12 18:29:33
From: John Thurston
On 2/12/2013 3:13 PM, bob_karambelas wrote:
> Don't know whether to thank you or curse you for pointing those out. I've been wanting a folder. ;)
>
> Not sure whether I'll do even do this, but thanks for the input.
>
>> Or a pair of Agfa Isolettes (LOTS on ebay) 50 to 100 each,
>> try and get the same lens and shutter on them
>>
>> They are folders, so you get a very compact rig
>>
>> Best,
>> John Billingham (2nd cheapest man in NYC)

I did the Isolette route once. Cleaned the lens, worked on
the bellows, set the focus, cleaned out the shutter
clockwork, tinkered with the shutter linkage, etc Getting
two of these in fully working condition would be painful.
And when I was done, I suspect their lenses would not be
very well matched.

Doing cha-cha's means you are at the mercy of the wind (and
other movement), but at least you are guaranteed a perfectly
matched focal length and field of view!

--
John Thurston
Juneau Alaska
http://stereo.thurstons.us
Subject: Re: Considering MF twin rig
Date: 2013-02-12 18:54:10
From: fatsostupidlife
You're welcome to curse me

: )

-----Original Message-----
>From: bob_karambelas <karambelas@gmail.com>
>Sent: Feb 12, 2013 7:13 PM
>To: MF3D-group@yahoogroups.com
>Subject: [MF3D-group] Re: Considering MF twin rig
>
>Don't know whether to thank you or curse you for pointing those out. I've been wanting a folder. ;)
>
>Not sure whether I'll do even do this, but thanks for the input.
>
>> Or a pair of Agfa Isolettes (LOTS on ebay) 50 to 100 each,
>> try and get the same lens and shutter on them
>>
>> They are folders, so you get a very compact rig
>>
>> Best,
>> John Billingham (2nd cheapest man in NYC)
>>
>
>
>
>------------------------------------
>
>Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
Subject: Re: Considering MF twin rig
Date: 2013-02-12 22:18:30
From: Brian Reynolds
John Thurston wrote:
>
> I did the Isolette route once. Cleaned the lens, worked on
> the bellows, set the focus, cleaned out the shutter
> clockwork, tinkered with the shutter linkage, etc Getting
> two of these in fully working condition would be painful.
> And when I was done, I suspect their lenses would not be
> very well matched.

If you want a working folder, without doing the work yourself, I would
suggest Jurgen Kreckel at Certo6 <http://www.certo6.com/>. I haven't
bought anything from him myself, but I've heard nothing but good
things from those who have. Isolettes are among his favorite folders.

I'm not sure if he offers repair services anymore. He sells cameras
he has rebuilt himself on ebay.

Personally I'm trying to avoid buying yet another camera, or two.

--
Brian Reynolds | "It's just like flying a spaceship.
reynolds@panix.com | You push some buttons and see
http://www.panix.com/~reynolds/ | what happens." -- Zapp Brannigan
NAR# 54438 |
Subject: Re: Considering MF twin rig
Date: 2013-02-12 23:23:16
From: David Lee
I am using a pair of Bronica SQA's, but also have several other pairs of medium format cameras that I would sell to you or anyone else that was interested in them. They are Fuji GS645S's, Mamiya C220's (with several pairs of lenses), and Rolleicords. They are all in good working condition and the lenses are pretty well matched.

David Lee

From: bob_karambelas
To: MF3D-group@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Mon, February 11, 2013 6:02:06 PM
Subject: [MF3D-group] Considering MF twin rig

 

I don't think it's something I'd use very often, so I can't get too fancy, but I've always wanted to shoot some scenic MF hypers. I have a Fuji GW690-II (90mm lens) and a GSW690-II (65mm), really great lenses on both. I wonder if it would be useful to double up one of them, which would cost ~$500. I could just shoot ten rolls and sell it, that's how I'll probably rationalize it. ;)

Obviously some issues, trigger by cable release only, but that should be good enough. But what to do with a 6x9 frame? There's no way to use commercial mounts or viewers, so I guess I'd just have to cut them down.

How badly might the lenses mismatch? If they're not perfect, are they often "good enough"? I've never noticed any problems using random 35mm lenses, but maybe MF is more demanding.

Subject: Re: Considering MF twin rig
Date: 2013-02-13 09:47:53
From: bob_karambelas
Yes, I found Jurgen, looks like he's the Dr T of folding cameras. I doubt I'd go through the trouble of sorting out a stereo pair of 1950's folders, but gee... some cool stuff in his eBay listings.



--- In MF3D-group@yahoogroups.com, Brian Reynolds wrote:

> If you want a working folder, without doing the work yourself, I would
> suggest Jurgen Kreckel at Certo6 . I haven't
> bought anything from him myself, but I've heard nothing but good
> things from those who have. Isolettes are among his favorite folders.
>
> I'm not sure if he offers repair services anymore. He sells cameras
> he has rebuilt himself on ebay.
>
> Personally I'm trying to avoid buying yet another camera, or two.
>
>
Subject: Re: Considering MF twin rig
Date: 2013-02-13 18:29:30
From: tpuhakka@ymail.com
All this talk of MF hyper has lead me to poke around ebay to see what 6x6 cameras are available for experimenting and I am now wondering how good the Lubitel 166 cameras are. some sources suggest pretty good glass anyhow. Any experience here?

Timo

--- In MF3D-group@yahoogroups.com, "bob_karambelas" wrote:
>
> Yes, I found Jurgen, looks like he's the Dr T of folding cameras. I doubt I'd go through the trouble of sorting out a stereo pair of 1950's folders, but gee... some cool stuff in his eBay listings.
>
>
>
> --- In MF3D-group@yahoogroups.com, Brian Reynolds wrote:
>
> > If you want a working folder, without doing the work yourself, I would
> > suggest Jurgen Kreckel at Certo6 . I haven't
> > bought anything from him myself, but I've heard nothing but good
> > things from those who have. Isolettes are among his favorite folders.
> >
> > I'm not sure if he offers repair services anymore. He sells cameras
> > he has rebuilt himself on ebay.
> >
> > Personally I'm trying to avoid buying yet another camera, or two.
> >
> >
>
Subject: Re: Considering MF twin rig
Date: 2013-02-13 20:56:26
From: dan wendes
Here's one I took with a pair of lubitels a few years ago, they are just visible in the mirror. 

http://i.imgur.com/vrBUG.jpg

I made a wooden block so their various knobs fitted snugly together side by side, but you wouldn't need this for hyper

Dan 

On 14 Feb 2013, at 07:29, "tpuhakka@ymail.com" <tpuhakka@ymail.com> wrote:

 

All this talk of MF hyper has lead me to poke around ebay to see what 6x6 cameras are available for experimenting and I am now wondering how good the Lubitel 166 cameras are. some sources suggest pretty good glass anyhow. Any experience here?

Timo

--- In MF3D-group@yahoogroups.com, "bob_karambelas" wrote:
>
> Yes, I found Jurgen, looks like he's the Dr T of folding cameras. I doubt I'd go through the trouble of sorting out a stereo pair of 1950's folders, but gee... some cool stuff in his eBay listings.
>
>
>
> --- In MF3D-group@yahoogroups.com, Brian Reynolds wrote:
>
> > If you want a working folder, without doing the work yourself, I would
> > suggest Jurgen Kreckel at Certo6 . I haven't
> > bought anything from him myself, but I've heard nothing but good
> > things from those who have. Isolettes are among his favorite folders.
> >
> > I'm not sure if he offers repair services anymore. He sells cameras
> > he has rebuilt himself on ebay.
> >
> > Personally I'm trying to avoid buying yet another camera, or two.
> >
> >
>

Subject: Re: Considering MF twin rig
Date: 2013-02-13 21:51:20
From: Brian Reynolds
tpuhakka@ymail.com wrote:
>
> All this talk of MF hyper has lead me to poke around ebay to see
> what 6x6 cameras are available for experimenting and I am now
> wondering how good the Lubitel 166 cameras are. some sources suggest
> pretty good glass anyhow. Any experience here?

I got my start in medium format, and MF3D, through a pair of Lubitel
166 Universals I bought from Freestyle. At the time they were about
$40 each, including shipping.

I put them on a simple flash bracket, and used a pair of cable
reelases to fire them.

They produced some very nice stereo pairs on my honeymoon.

My current Sputnik has a pair of Lubitel lenses.

--
Brian Reynolds | "It's just like flying a spaceship.
reynolds@panix.com | You push some buttons and see
http://www.panix.com/~reynolds/ | what happens." -- Zapp Brannigan
NAR# 54438 |
Subject: Re: Considering MF twin rig
Date: 2013-02-14 12:21:20
From: RodS
The Yashica TLR's can take super photos, and are priced between the Lubitel's and Rolie's. I had a Yashica D which was very sharp.

RS

--- In MF3D-group@yahoogroups.com, Brian Reynolds wrote:
>
> tpuhakka@... wrote:
> >
> > All this talk of MF hyper has lead me to poke around ebay to see
> > what 6x6 cameras are available for experimenting and I am now
> > wondering how good the Lubitel 166 cameras are. some sources suggest
> > pretty good glass anyhow. Any experience here?
>
> I got my start in medium format, and MF3D, through a pair of Lubitel
> 166 Universals I bought from Freestyle. At the time they were about
> $40 each, including shipping.
>
> I put them on a simple flash bracket, and used a pair of cable
> reelases to fire them.
>
> They produced some very nice stereo pairs on my honeymoon.
>
> My current Sputnik has a pair of Lubitel lenses.
>
> --
> Brian Reynolds | "It's just like flying a spaceship.
> reynolds@... | You push some buttons and see
> http://www.panix.com/~reynolds/ | what happens." -- Zapp Brannigan
> NAR# 54438 |
>
Subject: Re: Considering MF twin rig
Date: 2013-02-14 19:48:25
From: coronet3d
--- In MF3D-group@yahoogroups.com, "bob_karambelas" wrote:
"But what to do with a 6x9 frame? There's no way to use commercial mounts or viewers, so I guess I'd just have to cut them down."

I tried to build a twin rig with two Praktisix IIs using Flektogon 50mm lenses - using an "L" bar to get the lenses closer together. Super sharp image quality but the problem I ran into was having to crop the images more that I wanted to and not ending up with an adequate image area. A stereo camera has the lenses close together and usually has a little shift to give you more image area. With a twin rig, you need a little extra to crop it down to what you want. I then switched to using a Graflex XLSW with a Schneider Super Angulon 47mm f8 on a slide bar. I get all the image I want with the 6x9 but it hurts cutting off all of that film. My guess is that 6x7 would be ideal for cropping down to 6x6 images but 6x7 kits are even more expensive than some of the earlier 6x9 equipment. BTW, I am unaware of a folding camera with a good wide angle lens.
Steve
Subject: Re: Considering MF twin rig
Date: 2013-02-14 22:45:55
From: tpuhakka@ymail.com
--- In MF3D-group@yahoogroups.com, "coronet3d" wrote:

> BTW, I am unaware of a folding camera with a good wide angle lens.
>

Aye, there's the rub.

Timo
Subject: Re: Considering MF twin rig
Date: 2013-02-15 16:38:26
From: bob_karambelas
That's something I hadn't thought about... perhaps the extra area of a 6x9 frame is actually helpful. I could scan them first, if I bought a good scanner or got my Epson fixed. ;)

One possibility is to rent a second Fuji. If a planned trip comes about, I'll probably look into that. I've never had any luck with film cha-chas outdoors, there are too many things happening that you don't see until you mount the film. If I'm shooting MF, I want it as perfect as possible (even if it doesn't often come out that way).

A folding camera looks like an awesome 2D toy, but a 3D nightmare.


--- In MF3D-group@yahoogroups.com, "coronet3d" wrote:
> I tried to build a twin rig with two Praktisix IIs using Flektogon 50mm lenses - using an "L" bar to get the lenses closer together. Super sharp image quality but the problem I ran into was having to crop the images more that I wanted to and not ending up with an adequate image area.