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Subject: MF3D paper mount possibility
Date: 2015-10-23 21:19:55
From: Brian Reynolds

As you guys started discussing a 3D printed mount I was at Photo Plus
Expo.

While there I spoke with a gentleman from Apres Foto (a subsidiary of
University Products, a manufacturer and seller of archival mounting
and storage products). They had a nifty little cardstock fold up
business card case that they were giving out. I had thought that it
was laser cut, but it turns out that they die cut it.

While discussing this I showed him one of my mounted MF3D slides. He
said that they could make a die to cut similar mounts for about $75,
and then there would be a minimum order for the mounts. I didn't ask
what the minimum order would be, but I have a business card, and plan
to send some email.

So are people interested in ordering new cardboard MF3D mounts?

--
Brian Reynolds | "It's just like flying a spaceship.
reynolds@panix.com | You push some buttons and see
http://www.panix.com/~reynolds/ | what happens." -- Zapp Brannigan
NAR# 54438 |

Subject: Re: MF3D paper mount possibility
Date: 2015-10-23 22:13:46
From: Bob Venezia

Duh!

Bob Venezia

Seattle, Washington

On Oct 23, 2015, at 8:19 PM, Brian Reynolds mf3d@reynolds.users.panix.com [MF3D-group] <MF3D-group@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

As you guys started discussing a 3D printed mount I was at Photo Plus
Expo.

While there I spoke with a gentleman from Apres Foto (a subsidiary of
University Products, a manufacturer and seller of archival mounting
and storage products). They had a nifty little cardstock fold up
business card case that they were giving out. I had thought that it
was laser cut, but it turns out that they die cut it.

While discussing this I showed him one of my mounted MF3D slides. He
said that they could make a die to cut similar mounts for about $75,
and then there would be a minimum order for the mounts. I didn't ask
what the minimum order would be, but I have a business card, and plan
to send some email.

So are people interested in ordering new cardboard MF3D mounts?

--
Brian Reynolds | "It's just like flying a spaceship.
reynolds@panix.com | You push some buttons and see
http://www.panix.com/~reynolds/ | what happens." -- Zapp Brannigan
NAR# 54438 |

Subject: Re: MF3D paper mount possibility
Date: 2015-10-23 23:20:38
From: Jon Hoggatt

Absolutely; I’m down to my last 2 square ones, which a large majority of my views call for.

Let us know.

Thanks,

Jon Hoggatt

On Oct 23, 2015, at 10:19 PM, Brian Reynolds mf3d@reynolds.users.panix.com [MF3D-group] <MF3D-group@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

As you guys started discussing a 3D printed mount I was at Photo Plus
Expo.

While there I spoke with a gentleman from Apres Foto (a subsidiary of
University Products, a manufacturer and seller of archival mounting
and storage products). They had a nifty little cardstock fold up
business card case that they were giving out. I had thought that it
was laser cut, but it turns out that they die cut it.

While discussing this I showed him one of my mounted MF3D slides. He
said that they could make a die to cut similar mounts for about $75,
and then there would be a minimum order for the mounts. I didn't ask
what the minimum order would be, but I have a business card, and plan
to send some email.

So are people interested in ordering new cardboard MF3D mounts?

--
Brian Reynolds | "It's just like flying a spaceship.
reynolds@panix.com | You push some buttons and see
http://www.panix.com/~reynolds/ | what happens." -- Zapp Brannigan
NAR# 54438 |

Subject: Re: MF3D paper mount possibility
Date: 2015-10-31 12:20:45
From: iandvaag

Any word on this yet? I am also quite interested. I was wondering about the possibility of using acid-free paper. How important is this for archivability of mounted slides?

Ian

Subject: Re: MF3D paper mount possibility
Date: 2015-10-31 12:45:05
From: Brian Reynolds

iandvaag@gmail.com [MF3D-group] wrote:

>
> Any word on this yet? I am also quite interested. I was wondering
> about the possibility of using acid-free paper. How important is
> this for archivability of mounted slides?

I just sent a note off to the gentleman I met at Photo Plus Expo. I
wanted to see if there was any interest (besides me) before contacting
him.

University Products (the parent company of Apres Foto) manufactures
and sells archival storage products for libraries and museums. I
would expect that they would offer appropriate materials (at least as
an option).

To the best of my knowledge the original cardboard mounts never
claimed to be acid-free (not the only requirement for archival
materials). The various tapes and adhesives used to mount the slides
to the cardboard aren't necessarily archival either.

--
Brian Reynolds | "It's just like flying a spaceship.
reynolds@panix.com | You push some buttons and see
http://www.panix.com/~reynolds/ | what happens." -- Zapp Brannigan
NAR# 54438 |

Subject: Re: MF3D paper mount possibility
Date: 2015-10-31 16:37:10
From: Timo Puhakka

Another option, which has been discussed but nobody has reported back with results, is the computerized paper cutting machine. The Cricut is one example.

http://us.cricut.com/home/

This would allow somebody to make one-off slide mounts, on demand using acid free card stock. You could also cut your name or logo on the frame of the mount and put coloured paper behind it or a title window with the title behind it.

Timo

On 31-Oct-15, at 2:20 PM, iandvaag@gmail.com [MF3D-group] wrote:

Any word on this yet? I am also quite interested. I was wondering about the possibility of using acid-free paper. How important is this for archivability of mounted slides?

Ian

Subject: Re: MF3D paper mount possibility
Date: 2015-11-02 13:49:31
From: John Thurston

On 10/31/2015 10:45 AM, Brian Reynolds
mf3d@reynolds.users.panix.com [MF3D-group] wrote:

> iandvaag@gmail.com [MF3D-group] wrote:
>>
>> Any word on this yet? I am also quite interested. I was wondering
>> about the possibility of using acid-free paper. How important is
>> this for archivability of mounted slides?
>
> I just sent a note off to the gentleman I met at Photo Plus Expo. I
> wanted to see if there was any interest (besides me) before contacting
> him.

My concerns for the product production are:
Opacity. If I'm going to buy another set of mounts, I'd sure
like 'em to be opaque. Many of my white-mounts (even the
thicker) show the outline of my film chip and tape when backlit.

Consistency. A die suitable for stamping out business cards
may not be precise enough for what we expect from our
mounts. The die may also not wear in an acceptable manner.
"Fuzzies" which might be acceptable on the edge of a
business card would be a hassle in the image aperture.

But I trust you, Brian. If you bring us a product and tell
us it's good, I'm ready accept you've thought through the
details and will plunk some money down.

--
John Thurston
Juneau Alaska
http://stereo.thurstons.us

Subject: Re: MF3D paper mount possibility
Date: 2015-11-02 15:55:46
From: Brian Reynolds

John Thurston juneau3d@thurstons.us [MF3D-group] wrote:

>
> My concerns for the product production are:
> Opacity. If I'm going to buy another set of mounts, I'd sure
> like 'em to be opaque. Many of my white-mounts (even the
> thicker) show the outline of my film chip and tape when backlit.

I haven't had trouble with opacity with the original Rocky Mountain
Memories (from Joel and later Paul) white mounts. I'm not really a
fan of the later black mounts.

I have my doubts about the archival qualities of the black mounts, but
I have done no research or testing.

> Consistency. A die suitable for stamping out business cards
> may not be precise enough for what we expect from our
> mounts. The die may also not wear in an acceptable manner.
> "Fuzzies" which might be acceptable on the edge of a
> business card would be a hassle in the image aperture.

What I saw was a fold up business card holder/case, not business
cards.

> But I trust you, Brian. If you bring us a product and tell
> us it's good, I'm ready accept you've thought through the
> details and will plunk some money down.

I am glad you trust me, but you should be aware that I'm going into
this blind. The business card holder happened to catch my eye at
Photo Plus Expo, and they happen to do custom work. I have no
experience having this sort of die made, or dealing with them.

I have not yet heard back from Apres Foto. I have no idea what their
tolerances for die cutting are. I have no idea if I will be able to
get samples before committing to a production run. I do know that
their standard mounting and storage supplies are very good.

I'll let people know when I hear more.

--
Brian Reynolds | "It's just like flying a spaceship.
reynolds@panix.com | You push some buttons and see
http://www.panix.com/~reynolds/ | what happens." -- Zapp Brannigan
NAR# 54438 |

Subject: Re: MF3D paper mount possibility
Date: 2015-11-02 20:59:45
From: JR

As you are discovering, this is not as simple as it may first seem. You are correct in researching the many different aspects.

Regarding the elimination of edge "fuzzies", these are caused by two things, the sharpness or bluntness of the die and the type of card stock.

All dies will become dull in time. One type that is very good, actually has replaceable blades. These are like long razor blades that are cut to length, and fit into pre-machined grooves in the backing plate of the die. They can be made for either flat platen die plates or for curved roller plates (for high production continuous feed cutting).

Coated card stock will result in the smoothest edges along the cuts. Traditionally, these have been clay-coated, but today many paperboard materials are "plasticized", that is, actually coated with a thin plastic veneer.

Opacity is the major reason for black usually being preferred over white, but there is another reason too. White reflects light inside of either a viewer or projector, and this can "bounce back" to the slide itself, lowering the contrast ratio.

I have seen 35mm slide mounts with a thin layer of aluminum laminated between two cardboard sheets for opacity. I don't know if any MF mounts were ever made this way, but I have not seen any.

For my own MF slides, I use the WESS mounts. They are black plastic, very opaque, with very smooth edges. Since they are not cardboard, there is no sulfur to leach out, thereby making them quite archival. They are very rigid and hold the film flatter than the cardboard ones that I have seen. The ones that I use for stereo are pairs of mono 6 x 9 cm mounts that have an outer dimension (3-1/4 x 4 inches) that fit in the carriers of lantern slide projectors. Of course, I am talking about a pair of projectors (with external polarizers) for stereo.

John A. Rupkalvis

stereoscope3d@gmail.com

On Mon, Nov 2, 2015 at 1:55 PM, Brian Reynolds mf3d@reynolds.users.panix.com [MF3D-group] <MF3D-group@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

John Thurston juneau3d@thurstons.us [MF3D-group] wrote:
>
> My concerns for the product production are:
> Opacity. If I'm going to buy another set of mounts, I'd sure
> like 'em to be opaque. Many of my white-mounts (even the
> thicker) show the outline of my film chip and tape when backlit.

I haven't had trouble with opacity with the original Rocky Mountain
Memories (from Joel and later Paul) white mounts. I'm not really a
fan of the later black mounts.

I have my doubts about the archival qualities of the black mounts, but
I have done no research or testing.

> Consistency. A die suitable for stamping out business cards
> may not be precise enough for what we expect from our
> mounts. The die may also not wear in an acceptable manner.
> "Fuzzies" which might be acceptable on the edge of a
> business card would be a hassle in the image aperture.

What I saw was a fold up business card holder/case, not business
cards.

> But I trust you, Brian. If you bring us a product and tell
> us it's good, I'm ready accept you've thought through the
> details and will plunk some money down.

I am glad you trust me, but you should be aware that I'm going into
this blind. The business card holder happened to catch my eye at
Photo Plus Expo, and they happen to do custom work. I have no
experience having this sort of die made, or dealing with them.

I have not yet heard back from Apres Foto. I have no idea what their
tolerances for die cutting are. I have no idea if I will be able to
get samples before committing to a production run. I do know that
their standard mounting and storage supplies are very good.

I'll let people know when I hear more.

--
Brian Reynolds | "It's just like flying a spaceship.
reynolds@panix.com | You push some buttons and see
http://www.panix.com/~reynolds/ | what happens." -- Zapp Brannigan
NAR# 54438 |

Subject: Re: MF3D paper mount possibility
Date: 2016-02-22 13:54:05
From: bbrio3d

Definitely interested. I have almost run out of mounts. In fact, I have been researching on how to make the dies here in Brazil and running off a batch, I dunno, 2 to 3 thousand. My idea would be to replenish my stock (keeping, say, 500) and sell the rest at cost. So far, I'm not too inspired. I worry about the accuracy of the die and I'm also not sure about finding the correct cardboard to use (I believe it is commonly called chipboard, which comes in different weights) My remaining mounts seem to made from 32 point chipboard which means .032" thickness, I'm thinking that 46 point (.046") would be more rigid and maybe better.

But still looking around. I joined this group mainly to find out if there were other people looking around for mounts. I see some people selling for about a buck apiece which in my view is too expensive. I would have thought that if you made a run of 2000-3000 you could get the price way down. So I will follow this topic with interest.

Subject: Re: MF3D paper mount possibility
Date: 2016-02-23 15:04:29
From: jeremy3843

I liked the mounts stereo world used to put out- then Holga had a similar version sans the built in tape and outer label. The last batch I purchased by Holga were of a very poor quality. The units are impossible to snap together and I have to use tape on the outside of the mounts for added security. It's ridiculous to have such fine film stock mounted in utter garbage. Sorry to be so negative in tone, but I've had such frustration recently with regards to this issue.

Subject: Re: MF3D paper mount possibility
Date: 2016-02-23 16:05:53
From: Timo Puhakka

Looks like we have finally run out of old stock on MF Mounts. Most of us have a stock of mounts which we collected as they were discontinued, but now it looks like anybody new to MF stereo will have to come up with some other solution. There have been discussions of 3D printed plastic mounts, large batch die cut mounts and there is always the computer controlled craft cutting machines.

Timo

On 23-Feb-16, at 4:04 PM, jdmcgee13178@prodigy.net [MF3D-group] wrote:

I liked the mounts stereo world used to put out- then Holga had a similar version sans the built in tape and outer label. The last batch I purchased by Holga were of a very poor quality. The units are impossible to snap together and I have to use tape on the outside of the mounts for added security. It's ridiculous to have such fine film stock mounted in utter garbage. Sorry to be so negative in tone, but I've had such frustration recently with regards to this issue.